R.K.: And I believe that, and a big part of the campaign is getting funding to start spelling out initially just spelling out the parameters and the considerations. There ought to be a big conference that says, that looks at the economics of it, the costs in terms of prisons and crime, the costs in terms of corruption, the costs in terms of damage to people and their personal lives, and then looks at all the different ethical considerations that are possible in terms of identifying and developing models for helping to keep people from being hurt and helping those who have the genes and the brain structure which we barely talked about, to not hurt people and to understand what they have because you didn't even realize it and you're a brilliant guy and you didn't even know were a psychopath, or a pro-social psychopath, or a lucky sociopath, psychopath, whatever word you want to use. You didn't even know it until it was pounded into your head with reality many, many times.
J.F.: Finding out what I was doing was abusive to people in such a subtle way but it was a kind of bullying. I was my own enemy and I didn't even realize it.
R.K.: So maybe we can continue this conversation afterwards because I would like to help. I would like to see billions of dollars being spent on this because I think it deserves it and I would like to have some help because I know enough politicians because of the other side of the work I do, to start getting them to start talking about this in a way that makes sense.
J.F.: Well, you know, Rob, this is fantastic to hear because I've never heard anybody else talk about it in such a comprehensive way and that's the vision you need because you've got to put your arms around every part of this in order to ask the right questions. And spend the money wisely, too, because you can just throw money at things, that's no good, but to define all the issues like you're saying up front is a way for efficient and good research to start.
R.K.: Well maybe we can take this conversation on afterwards. One last thing, I did want to talk to you about while we're on is libertarianism and politics and this whole idea. Where does your brain and your genetics fit in with your libertarianism?
J.F.: Well, starting when I was, like I said in my late teens, when I lost my emotionality in a big way and became much more intellectual, I had a very intellectual view of the world and people and things. That's when I became a libertarian. That was when it first started and I saw that as a rational way for the world to respond. Not an emotion way, not ad hominem, sort of making believe you care, but doing things based on objectively how you can do the search for good without all of the sort of appeal to emotion and, really, I thought it was the way to go and it was the way ultimately to have ultimate fairness and justice which became very important to me, as opposed to telling people, or listening to people say I feel your pain and that kind of phony stuff. I thought a lot of what was going on was phony.
R.K.: You're quoting Bill Clinton of course.
J.F.: Of course. He's one of the best conservative presidents we had, besides JFK, but I was a real liberal, but when everything turned left in 1969, 68, and when the right, the conservatives, they turned kind of more fascistic, I dropped both of them. I thought it was not the way to go and I really studied up and became a libertarian from then on.
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