Medea Benjamin: I would say, "You're really brave to be even
be wanting to do this, and it's great that you're so passionate about this issue. You are about to go into an area where people
are in total disagreement with you. You
don't want them to hate you, and yet you want them to know that you have a
message that's important for them to hear.
So try not scream; try to project, try to stay calm, and make sure that
you know exactly what your message is.
Let's hear you say it. Can you
say it louder than that? What are you
going to do if somebody starts to pull on you?
And don't lose your temper! Try
to stay cool the whole time, because if you're a peace activist and you are
seen to be aggressive, then your message is not going to get heard." And then I would say, "And don't worry if it
doesn't come off the way you want it to, because oftentimes these things don't
work, and this is the practice for you.
So just go in with the best of intentions, and we'll see how it goes!"
Rob Kall: If you
attempt to do one of these and it's fabulously successful, what has
happened? In other words, what are the
criteria, or benchmarks, or measurements that you can use for success in doing
this?
Medea Benjamin: One is if the media picks it up and it starts
to get out, and what gets out is the message that you had, because we don't
have a lot of access to CNN, or ABC News, or the New York Times, the Washington
Post; so if they pick it up, then that's successful. If there is a great photo that was taken, and
that gets spread around and you see it popping up in places around the world,
that's successful. Sometimes, believe it
or not, it does actually lead to us getting a meeting with somebody who then
decides, "Better to meet these people then have them popping up in these kind
of venues." And then if, after the
meeting you actually see a change in the policy, well that's certainly
successful.
I used to do this more about corporate issues:
issues like sweatshops, or Fair Trade.
And there, we would go to shareholder meetings, and get up in front of a
shareholder meeting; and you can be enormously successful, because when you
embarrass the CEO, or embarrass the company, you could see immediate changes in
policies. So success is getting media
attention for the issue, but the ultimate success is getting movement on the
issue that you're trying to affect. One
thing I also would say to people who try to do this is to not let it go to your
head, because sometimes you do get a flurry of attention afterward, but I tell
them "It'll die down very quickly, and remember, it's not about you, you are
just a voice at the moment of something much larger."
Rob Kall: What about
how it feels? You spoke to the
President, you engaged in a dialogue with him, then you are being pulled out
and you're still talking to the President, you're outside the room, you're with
the police; what are the feelings that are associated that? I've talked and spoken to other activists who
have gotten themselves arrested or at least grabbed, and they love it. It feels great! What about you? What are the feelings that are involved with
it?
Medea Benjamin: I don't love it, and I don't say it feels
great. I was sure I was going to get
arrested, and I was dreading that. I
really don't like to be arrested. I
don't like the feeling of being claustrophobic in a cell, I don't like being in
handcuffs, I don't like doing it by myself.
If I'm going to get arrested, I like to do it with other people. I don't like all the time and money and
energy it takes to (often) go back to court and all that's involved in
that. So I don't "like" it, and I don't
like the uncertainty about what's going to happen to you. I mean, the woman was threatening to arrest
me. I was assuming I was getting
arrested. I didn't know if it was a
Federal offense because I was on a military base, I wasn't sure how severe the
charges might be. So, a lot of things
are going through my head at the same time, like, "Oh, I wonder what's going to
happen now. My phone is dying! How am I going to get a message to the
outside?"
But there's also a certain serenity to the whole
thing. In fact, I was feeling quite serene afterward, because I did feel that
it was the right thing. If it had gone
badly I would have felt differently; but I felt like I got to address the
President on three different occasions, that he actually answered me, and so I
felt I was ready to face the consequences, whatever they were, and I thought it
was worth it.
Rob Kall: OK. So, that sounds like that was a good
feeling. But were you nervous or scared
while you were speaking, were you confident?
I'm just trying to go through the kinds of emotions that you experience
during the different stages which only took a couple seconds, really, I guess,
but -
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