Rob Kall: Okay. That's interesting. Now, you talk about villains, and you say, "I often root for the bad guy, I know I'm alone I'm not alone in my love of the villain, in him we see freedom," what's that about?
M.E. Thomas: You know, I *chuckles* I don't know. You, you watch these movies, and what is a good example? Dexter, Dexter's probably the best example of somebody who's the villain but he's the protagonist right? And people, people want him to do these things, largely because, you know, even though he's doing these horrible things, and they knew, they know that he's not doing it for good reasons. He's not an altruist necessarily going around killing these people. He's not a vigilante in the classic sense of the term. He, he likes killing people, that that's still, sort of okay behavior.
I think, I think people, I like villains because I sort of identify with their ruthlessness. I think other people identify with villains because, or, or like villains or are fascinated with villains, including sociopaths, because there's this perceived sense of freedom. You know sociopaths, villains, they don't, they just do what they want. And they're not necessarily worried about guilt or other feelings or living a safe life.
I was actually just, watching a version of Treasure Island, you know where the whole plot is you could have this normal life, and live, you know be an apprentice and get married and have children and do these things, or you could go off and live this adventure. And I think villain stories are almost like adventure stories to people, where you think, they think, "My life, I like my life, it's a safe life, it's a comfortable life, but there's something compelling also about doing something completely different".
We have a Robert Frost poem, right? The Road Not Taken, idea of, do you want to go down the well tread path, or do you want to do something different?
Rob Kall: Okay. You know, the world of story, is one I've been very interested in, so it's so you like the villain, the antagonist in the story. Have you, have you thought at all about how villains and antagonists in movies are portrayed, do you have any critiques, or way, how, how does somebody make a better villain in a story?
M.E. Thomas: I think people make a compelling villain by, making them complicated. And even have contradictions, because I, I think everybody has contradictory elements to their life. And some of the criticism about the book has been, there are contradictions in the book, where people, I say one thing at one place and then say something seemingly, something contradictory some place else.
Well I think we, we all naturally have contradictions, we all think one thing in a situation or behave one thing in a different situation, right? So I think, you know, people watching Game of Thrones, do you watch Game of Thrones?
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